Curse

Killed u man · Jul 01, 2009, 02:45 PM // 14:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seraphim of Chaos

mirage cloack has 1/4th cast time and you can combine it with mystic sandstorm to do more damage

Yes, and Swirling Aura gives you a 50% Chance to block projectiles, but that ain't gonna help your team either...

Aegis was a PARTYWIDE block, I don't think U understand that.

Mirage cloak, aside from the fact that noone uses dervishes besides for WS, is a pretty useless skill in HA.

Seraphim of Chaos · Jul 01, 2009, 04:47 PM // 16:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killed u man

Aegis was a PARTYWIDE block, I don't think U understand that.

just maek every1 a dervish n bring mirage cloack lol

when was the last time you went to HA? lol

ImpressiveSkilled · Jul 01, 2009, 10:00 PM // 22:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seraphim of Chaos

just maek every1 a dervish n bring mirage cloack lol

when was the last time you went to HA? lol

stop trash talking

Div · Jul 02, 2009, 01:11 AM // 01:11

Are we seriously talking about mirage cloak? Real men bring SoD.

Coast · Jul 02, 2009, 09:39 AM // 09:39

bring shields up

Killed u man · Jul 02, 2009, 03:00 PM // 15:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coast

bring shields up

Rspike kills throug it, clean. (Will just as clean as always)

Most of the damage, which is the problem, is armor ignoring.

The spike is about 450 armor ignoring damage, and then a 100 "dmg" DW, thus, even if arrows do like 10 damage each, you'll kill... (Eventually)

Krill · Jul 03, 2009, 04:36 PM // 16:36

I always wondered why anet never bothered to restore shields up to blocking after VoD was removed since that was the problem.

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

Are we seriously talking about mirage cloak? Real men bring SoD.

What about dervs with mirage cloak and SoD!? But wait, who was the last person to run some cheesy mystic sandstorm spike with all defensive dervs, was it the mighty borat? Nah couldn't be.

bitchbar player · Jul 04, 2009, 10:48 PM // 22:48

Ok borat you out did yourself this time, r-spike armor ignoring.......

Elri · Jul 04, 2009, 11:24 PM // 23:24

I hear the sprouts are nice in Belgium..

Reverend Dr · Jul 05, 2009, 01:38 AM // 01:38

Actually a good deal of the damage from Rspike is armor ignoring. That is why R-spike has never brought elemental bows to have to spike out warriors. Shields up worked well against r-spike back when it added block, but right now it is not worth bringing in any build.

Dragnmn · Jul 05, 2009, 08:52 AM // 08:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend Dr

AThat is why R-spike has never brought elemental bows to have to spike out warriors.

Actually, it does, I do anyway. You have 2 unused weapon sets, and it's still a little bit more damage on spikes. Everything helps. The good part is that it doesn't matter much if someone forgets to switch.

bitchbar player · Jul 05, 2009, 11:28 AM // 11:28

uhm you shouldnt have 2 empty slots, apparently you are not using a shield set.

And yeah some damage is armor ignoring but on the galss arrow r-spike it is around 100 damage in total, not 450 like borat claims it to be.

The punishing shot version has a little bit more but will be around 150 ish.

And clean spiking a warrior is never easy with r-spike, a simple rof can safe him.

Killed u man · Jul 05, 2009, 01:32 PM // 13:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crom Bocca

""

Favorable: +6
Brutal: +16
Glass Arrows: +19
Vamp: +3
Deep Wound: 100

Optional: Anthem of Envy: +22 (I think it triggers on only 1 attack)

That's: 6+16+19+3 = 44 Damage per arrow, guaranteed.

WHOOPS, I FEEL A BORATHAMMER COMMING DOWN UPON HA AGAIN:

44 DAMAGE * 9 = 396 Damage over the total of 9 arrows.

Optional +66 Damage from Envy.
Deep Wound for 100 damage.

Zoh Mah God, Borat was right, YET AGAIN, can u believe it?

In total:

396 + 100 = 496 armor ignoring damage.

With Envy: 496 + 66 = 562 armor ignoring damage.

Also, don' bullshit Grom, I played rspike a few days ago, due to it being the only build you can pug relativly fast, and it's a complete joke...

If the Chest thumper hits before most of your arrows, you can clean spike warriors. If it hits after, the first hit after DW will finish him off.

Ow yeah, and Hammer warriors go down just as fast as casters... (Only have 20 more armor)

Either way, atleast 500 damage from the spike is armor ignoring, so my point is valid.

Trinity Fire Angel · Jul 05, 2009, 02:01 PM // 14:01

yeah, rspike is shit. even as a prot, its farking hard to deal with. i found the only way i could cope for at least 10 mins of the match was to stand as close as i could to channel and just throw spam out my prots on all the squishies... then my warrior gets spiked... almost enough time to cancel my SoA to put SB on... almost

sooooo.... any ideas of what builds are currently pwning rspike?

Teutonic Paladin · Jul 05, 2009, 04:36 PM // 16:36

Vital Weapon / Defensive Anthem maybe?

Phe Belladona · Jul 05, 2009, 04:37 PM // 16:37

+5 vamp for bows borat!!!! add another 18!

but yeh you can ofc make rspike look terrifying but you are assuming nothing gets interupted or diverted and everything hits.

Killed u man · Jul 06, 2009, 04:17 PM // 16:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phe Belladona

+5 vamp for bows borat!!!! add another 18!

but yeh you can ofc make rspike look terrifying but you are assuming nothing gets interupted or diverted and everything hits.

I was assuming at full spike potential. OFFCOURSE, even in my shitty balanced teams, a ranger usually gets interrupted. (First spike = always cried)

The problem is that ASIDE from the fact that you HAVE to interrupt a ranger, you also have to worry about an optional DA, vital weapons and 3 Monks.

Now, you can say whatever you want, but Rspike does NOT die through pressure. Being ignorant as HA forum posters are, REALIZE that if a balanced with pretty much no midline, aside from Life, Kaolei and WoW, can stay alive for about 4-5 minutes with only 2 Monks, It's only logic to assume a Rspike with 3 Monks will stay alive ALOT longer.

But I'm pretty much repeating my old statements and facts all over again. Rspike is OP, and requires FLAWLESS play to beat it. (And if you face a flawless Rspike, they won't die)

I'm just trying to make clear that loosing to rspike is nothing to worry about/be e-ashamed off. Look at it as loosing in a Knife War (In any shooter) too someone with a gun.

Krill · Jul 06, 2009, 05:07 PM // 17:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killed u man

Now, you can say whatever you want, but Rspike does NOT die through pressure. Being ignorant as HA forum posters are, REALIZE that if a balanced with pretty much no midline, aside from Life, Kaolei and WoW, can stay alive for about 4-5 minutes with only 2 Monks, It's only logic to assume a Rspike with 3 Monks will stay alive ALOT longer.

There appears to be a large gap in your reasoning here.

1. OoS rit in balanced is 100% defensive now. Splinter and ancestor's are junk, channeled strike much harder to use after pwk nerfs made that less desirable and more difficult to hold. So there's not even a token amount of offense on an OoS anymore.

2. Balanced usually has defense on their snare too, UG is definitely defensive and a melandru's ranger is mostly defensive.

3. Rspike has had their defense indirectly nerfed. Taking DA over shatter storm is a sure way to lose, combined with the WoW nerf it can be difficult to protect the rangers w/o using enchants.

So yes, it can be difficult to pressure an rspike backline when you're running an equal amount of defense. It's not nearly as bad as it used to be though.

I find rspike is strongest on objective maps. Relic runs they have two wards and two hex breakers that give a pretty big advantage. Although it's less common now, when they had water trident it could be an absolute nightmare. KotH they can pretty much spike at will w/o having to use rigor after the WoW nerf. Cap points, again they can easily spike ghost and the team as a whole tends to take less damage on alters from fire AoE with three rangers and a para. They can also split on cap points better than a lot of teams. Overall the spike itself is almost a moot point.

Killed u man · Jul 06, 2009, 05:53 PM // 17:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krill

1. OoS rit in balanced is 100% defensive now. Splinter and ancestor's are junk, channeled strike much harder to use after pwk nerfs made that less desirable and more difficult to hold. So there's not even a token amount of offense on an OoS anymore.

2. Balanced usually has defense on their snare too, UG is definitely defensive and a melandru's ranger is mostly defensive.

3. Rspike has had their defense indirectly nerfed. Taking DA over shatter storm is a sure way to lose, combined with the WoW nerf it can be difficult to protect the rangers w/o using enchants.

1) True, but a rit still doesn't compare to a third monk, ON TOP OF THE RIT a rspike already has. And the Rit taking lesser offensive skills only adds to my arguement it's too hard to kill a rspike.

2) UG is defence, but in terms of Rspike, it will only protect you against 1 spike tops. (And even that is argueable) Eruption is better defence, but the rspike usually has got RC + draw (I would bring anyways), thus blinds should't be that much of a problem.
On top of they, they're both dshot fodders. (Rspike usually watches the Earth ele and mesmer for interrupts)

3) Nerfing 1% defence of a build with 100% more defence than other builds still leaves the build with 99% more defence. On top of that, the Shatter Storm para is ONLY ran because of the Mantra of Resolve => SoC combination. So in that perspective, they've lost a really good block skill, but gained a GUARANTEED cap (aside from PD) on KoTH. Something which NO OTHER TEAM BUILD CAN AFFORD TO BRING.

Ok but seriously, I apologize for falling into the old discussion again. I'll refrain myself from posting stuff related to rspike discussion now

Ciric · Jul 06, 2009, 06:47 PM // 18:47

How To Beat R-Spike:
A Guide by Ciric

1. Kill Favorable, now that rtw is nerfed killing fav kills the only flight time reduction in the build, spikes arn't as clean, and can be dodged... easy.
2. Interrupt the brutals/ orders. Do I need to explain this really?
3. Do NOT waste interrupts like PD on rangers dual/forked or w/e they run today. Mesmer needs to be monk stomping like hell.
4. Prot good, don't only prot the spike, but also try to keep a guardian on your Mesmer or caster that might be interrupted at all times, this will force them to waste an enchant removal on spikes, and keep them from getting d-shotted. (prot the actual spikes with SB!). If you're a bad prot, spam prot the shit outa yourself, and other softies such as a mesmer, camp a warding on the infuse, and pray.
5. Do not run and hide behind walls, good r-spikes will just run outa ur range and you lose any pressure you had on them.
6. On relics, do not let them get DP on you, keep a guardian on your snare.
7. On KotH (if you're holding) push into the r-spike so that they eat damage from the other teams AoE and you.
8. Don't be pussies. Kill them, full press and lock down their defence, they will die.

Thank You for your time